The error in The Phantom Menace...

R2lass · Jedi Knight Joined: Aug 17, 2005 Posts: 357

Reyla_Zingara wrote:

Ah, well it's like I said after starting to read Cloak Of Deception and then becoming grossly disgusted with the author: If people don't already understand SW, they have no business reading the books. If you're a newbie and you're not smart enough to read into SW and go behind the scenes to further understand the story, then for goodness sakes, save yourself the trouble and don't bother.

Just curious. Are you calling me a newbie? You kind of lost me there in what you said.

tml1138 · Jedi Knight Joined: Jan 17, 2005 Posts: 409

There's so many fine details I could pick apart, but key points that just make TPM the worst of the six films:

Not enough Obi-Wan. His character was poorly used in TPM.

Bad acting. Every main character had some wooden lines in this film.

Midichlorians. Yuck.

Jar Jar. Yuck. Not only that, but the very first time I saw TPM, I couldn't understand the Gungans. Especially Boss Nass. Because of this, I think any connection, an audience member of the film, was lost. Now after seeing the film multiple times, I understand them no problem. But first impressions are always lasting impressions.

Darth Maul. Here we thought we were going to have another Vader type figure. Didn't happen. He was so underused and further more had no real purpose. The saber duel between the Jedi and him was cool-looking for sure, but it had no meaning behind it. All we had given to us, was "Darth Maul is a bad guy". End of story. So it left the whole purpose of the final duel empty.

The Trade Federation's whole occupation and blockade as part of the plot was weak. We see no one suffering or dying on the planet when they attack, so we have no feelings to share with Padme when she is urging the Senate to help her. And upon her return to Naboo, the blockade is suddenly gone. Never did understand why all the ships left.

The final battles are weak. Compared to Luke's victory on the 1st Death Star battle, they are just lame. The ground battle is mostly antics of Jar Jar, and the space battle of Anakin is all by goofs and luck. Neither of these come close to being as good as the ground battle of Hoth or the space battle of Yavin and the 1st Death Star.

Other than Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon, the Jedi did nothing in TPM except sit around and give orders to Obi and Qui. This was very disappointing and made you wonder what GL was talking about with Jedi enforcing good all over the galaxy in his new trilogy. AOTC changed some of that of course, but before then, we got two Jedi doing all the work.

I could probably add more, but those are the main points that make TPM the worst SW film, IMO.

DarkMara · Jedi Knight Joined: May 26, 2005 Posts: 485

Let me preface this to some of our newer members: we express our opions openly here & it's not meant in anyway to insult or undermine anyone.

THAT being said: AMEN TROY! Phantom Menace was a disaster! The gungungs, Evil or Very Mad

, a lil 8 year-old BLOWING a droid control ship without a CLUE of what he was doing Evil or Very Mad

& Obi-Wan was too whiny-butt! BUT that's just MY opinion because I grew up being obsessed with the original trilogy, so I had VERY high expectations. It appears, again, just a generalization, not to be taken literally, that the ones who adore TPM are the ones who got into Star Wars BECAUSE of that.

But remember, more than likely, the newbies are the ones who like TPM, not the ones who dislike it. I know for a FACT that Lisa is old-school like me, & KNOWS her Star Wars. We just prefer to not include TPM in that.

TheRandomMenace · Jedi Knight Joined: Mar 30, 2004 Posts: 1886

Actually, I liked Star Wars before the Special Editions came out, and thus before TPM...

That being said, I still enjoy watching TPM more than I do ANH. Yes, Jar Jar's mishaps during the droid battle are ridiculous, as is his character in general, and yes, it's crazy to think the Chosen One started out as an inept "yippeeing" little crybaby, but I find TPM to be way more entertaining than ANH. If you think about it, there are a lot of long moments in ANH with little or no action. Plus I found the whole concept of a seemingly insignificant blockade of some remote planet as nothing more than a distraction to get Palpatine into power to be an amazing plot point... I give tons of credit to George for that, that was one of the things he did right in the prequels.

DarkMara · Jedi Knight Joined: May 26, 2005 Posts: 485

AMEN on the Special Editions Random! I think the spiffed up effects were great, but they should have LEFT the storyline ALONE. That being said:

HAN SHOT FIRST!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Reyla_Zingara · Youngling Joined: Oct 02, 2005 Posts: 62

Padme92 wrote:

In The Hidden Past aka book 3 Obi-wan never visits his family...they are memories before the Jedi took him in and he started to train. Family is forbidden after starting to become a Jedi...I know what you are talking about, i think it was Bant but I'm not sure...yeah like Anakin says in AOTC attactment is forbidden and family is a attactment...

I remember after ready about what Qui-Gon did I couldn't believe it! It was another two months before the 6th book came out so I had two months of Obi-wan being out of the Jedi Order that way! I was dying!
Also the complete TPM soundtrack...you mean the one with Maul on the cover and the whole two disc right? Yeah thats a great find for only $11! I paid full price for that!

Are you serious? I could have sworn it said that he visited his family and that it was encouraged. I'll have to rent that book out and read it again. Didn't Lucas say somewhere that in the very rough drafts of SW, Owen Lars *was* Obi's brother, but they changed it later? I swear I read that somewhere. ::stares off into space looking for the information::

Well, if it makes your wait seem any less stressful, I had to wait for the next book as well. The Orlando libraries are so insanely slow with their reservation service! They won't let you just reserve a book to pick it up, it's reserved and then mailed to your door when it comes in. Only problem is that it can take them anywhere from 3 days to 12 to actually get around to sending you your book. I had book #9 reserved since April. Come July I completely gave up on them, and when I came back home to Cleveland I was able to get it from my library within a WEEK. Ha! Cleveland beats Orlando any day! Very Happy

And I had been dying to get that soundtrack since the day it came out but I couldn't afford it. My waiting paid off:D

Speaking of books that include Obi-Wan, have you read Secrets Of The Jedi? Wow. I was blown away. I read it months ago in Orlando, and I just took it out at the library this week for a second read. I love books that show that Obi-Wan was alive, had personality, he wasn't just some old goat like he tends to come off as in the movies (::hurls rotten tomatoes at George Lucas: Smile

.

Reyla_Zingara · Youngling Joined: Oct 02, 2005 Posts: 62

R2lass wrote:

Just curious. Are you calling me a newbie? You kind of lost me there in what you said.

Noooo...I'm saying if you've never seen SW and you sit down and watch it for the first time, then at the end say: "Well that was stupid, confusing, and pointless. Dumb movie."
Then why'd you bother? If you're not interested enough to ask questions, give it a second viewing, or try and understand the story and characters better, then you shall never be a Star Wars fan. This is mostly frustration from the book I started to read. This author was going to extreme annoying lengths to completely fully describe everything and anything in the SW world, and I got so fed up thast I just quit reading it. And since when does Obi-Wan talk nasal??? Shocked

I think I'd still be considered a newbie in many ways (or just stupid). Example: A few weeks ago my brother and I were out and about, and I turned to him and said: "So....what was all that business with the trade federation about anyway?"
He simply stared at me and then apparently decided that such stupidity did not merit a response. What can I say, I'm quite slow sometimes. I get it now, but hey. Wink

Jedi_ObiKin · Jedi Knight Joined: Aug 29, 2005 Posts: 196

Everything Jar Jar
Lil Ani
The gross overuse of calling Anakin, Ani
Everything Jar Jar
Lil Ani
The gross overuse of calling Anakin, Ani
Oh, sorry......
Not enough Obi Wan
Lengthy pod race

The film broke with only 20 minutes left when i first saw Phantom
and the theatre awarded tix for a free rescreening. It was terribly painful and disappointing. Crying or Very sad

Darth Maul, Qui Gon, Obi duel was the coolest and the shortest part!

I just picked up Secrets of the Jedi. Can't wait to read it tonight! Still waiting on Stark library system to obtain Dark Warning. Sad

Ghent_the_Slicer · Padawan Joined: Sep 03, 2005 Posts: 649

Personally, I thought Ep. I was great. This probably has something to do with the fact that when it came out was when I really realized what Star Wars was & really got into it. I started reading the books & collecting the action figures. Anyhow, Ep. I had a big part in my becoming a Star Wars fan, so I think it's still really cool...

Reyla_Zingara · Youngling Joined: Oct 02, 2005 Posts: 62

And lest we forget that Episode 1 brought us that youthful spunky Obi-Wan Kenobi:D

Jedi_ObiKin · Jedi Knight Joined: Aug 29, 2005 Posts: 196

Ghent_the_Slicer wrote:

Personally, I thought Ep. I was great. This probably has something to do with the fact that when it came out was when I really realized what Star Wars was & really got into it. I started reading the books & collecting the action figures. Anyhow, Ep. I had a big part in my becoming a Star Wars fan, so I think it's still really cool...

Somehow I feel old because of your quote Razz

... "when it came out, was when I really realized what SW was.." I said the same thing in '77! Sad

Ghent_the_Slicer · Padawan Joined: Sep 03, 2005 Posts: 649

My dad was 10 in '77...

Beltayn · Jedi Knight Joined: Apr 18, 2004 Posts: 1712

Oh man....now I'm starting to feel REALLY old... Razz

Obi-WanJay · Events Councillor Joined: May 24, 2005 Posts: 380

Quote:

HAN SHOT FIRST!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Han shot period.

i was a youngling in '77but i still feel old

Reyla_Zingara · Youngling Joined: Oct 02, 2005 Posts: 62

I was born the year ROTJ came out, I may have technically seen it while in my mother's womb, but this fact has not yet been researched. Wink