If you had to choose....

Coyote · Jedi Knight Joined: Aug 15, 2004 Posts: 416

One main character from the Original or Prequel Trilogys to kill off in the movies who would it be. In other words they would have to die before the end of RoTS. Give me a name a circumstance of their death. Jar Jar is my obvious choice, so that one is too easy.

My choice: The Falcon is seriously damaged after escaping the exploding DSII. Lando brings her back to Han, but is fatally injured in the crash landing.

Krash · Jedi Knight Joined: Mar 20, 2004 Posts: 3495

Prequels: I think I would have given Mace Windu a more "honorable" death then getting sucker-punch slashed by Anakin then dropped out the window by Palpatine. The whole "stabbed in the back" thing with Anakin could have been done more dramatically and I think of all the jedi Mace should have gone down fighting to the last breath.

Classic: Believe it or not, I would have killed off one of the capital ships with General Madine onboard. In such a massive naval battle, I find it hard to imagine that any of the Rebellion's leaders wouldn't die in the battle; since the committed their entire fleet to the battle. In the book "Star Wars: The Action Figure Archives" there's a picture from a deleted scene in ROTJ of Madine commanding one of the cruisers from a seat just like the one Ackbar is seen in. I think it'd been cool as heck to watch Madine (a former Imperial) drive his crippled crusier right into the bridge of the Executor.

DonC · Senior Councillor Joined: Mar 30, 2004 Posts: 950

Coyote wrote:

My choice: The Falcon is seriously damaged after escaping the exploding DSII. Lando brings her back to Han, but is fatally injured in the crash landing.

Actually, early drafts of Jedi had Lando dying while trying to escape the Death Star. The line Han says about thinking he won't see the Falcon again was meant to foreshadow this, but it was decided to let Lando live.

Anyhoo, the prequels really don't have anyone I'd kill (besides Jar Jar) who doesn't die, or has to live (IE: people in the OT). A scene where Obi-Wan had to kill Commander Cody would have been good. It would emphasize the emotional toll Order 66 took on the Jedi.

Original trilogy is tough. I'm trying to still have the movie PG so killing Leia and having Han go nuts and blow up the Imperial bunker and everyone in it is too extreme. Maybe one of the droids? They're the "narrators" of the story so to speak and Jedi is/was the end of the story, so why not kill the narrators? Problem is both of them were blasted to pieces throughout the trilogy and reassembled. So I don't know who I'd kill.

jedi_bmack · Communication Councillor Joined: Feb 08, 2004 Posts: 1248

hmmm... this is a new one... and Don so completely stole my thunder on most of this...

lesseee... uhhh... PT character... hmm... well, most of them die... and it'd be hard to pick one who didn't without completely changing the whole plot line... soooooooo... yeah, i'm with Jim on the JarJar thing... i say he ticks off a wookiee as a non-violent protester on Kashyyk... arms, legs and ears go flying... wookiees then take to wearing gungan ears as badges of triumph, or boredom since they can't pose a huge challenge...

OT: this one's even rougher... same plot line issue as with the PT only worse... especially since i can't just ignore the EU... don't wanna scald Wedge... too cool... Lando? if he dies, we probably won't get his Colt 45 ads? dead men make no sales... (HA!) uhhh... Ackbar? too easy to make the Fried Mon Calamari jokes.... Han? nope... who marries Leia then? Prince Isolder? can you say galactic incident? Jabba? nope already dead... Boba? supposedly already dead... Yoda? dead... Emperor? dead... Vader? dead... uhhh... Leia? somebody's gotta hold the galaxy together, cuz Farmboy can't do it all by his lonesome... Luke? yeah, yea... catching on fire from Vader's pyre and burning to death... wait... nah... too poetic... Chewie? nope, bites it in *spoiler deleted*

yeah, can't pin one down on the OT right now...

maybe later...

-b-

Jedi_Minch · Youngling Joined: Aug 11, 2006 Posts: 158

Coyote wrote:

One main character from the Original or Prequel Trilogys to kill off in the movies who would it be.

Define "main".

Coyote wrote:

In other words they would have to die before the end of RoTS. Give me a name a circumstance of their death. Jar Jar is my obvious choice, so that one is too easy.

For the moment defining "main" to mean anyone with a name, a line, and not a part of the background--Dexter Jettster. He knew too much about Kamino. Jango should have whacked him before he left Coruscant. Heck, he should have whacked him before Obi-Wan got there...

Coyote wrote:

My choice: The Falcon is seriously damaged after escaping the exploding DSII. Lando brings her back to Han, but is fatally injured in the crash landing.

Now that's one heckuva crash, that the ship survives but not the pilot...

In the original trilogy...that's a hard one to call. Is Mon Mothma "main" enough?

Jedi Minch

Coyote · Jedi Knight Joined: Aug 15, 2004 Posts: 416

Jedi_Minch wrote:

Coyote wrote:

One main character from the Original or Prequel Trilogys to kill off in the movies who would it be.

Define "main".

Coyote wrote:

In other words they would have to die before the end of RoTS. Give me a name a circumstance of their death. Jar Jar is my obvious choice, so that one is too easy.

For the moment defining "main" to mean anyone with a name, a line, and not a part of the background--Dexter Jettster. He knew too much about Kamino. Jango should have whacked him before he left Coruscant. Heck, he should have whacked him before Obi-Wan got there...

Coyote wrote:

My choice: The Falcon is seriously damaged after escaping the exploding DSII. Lando brings her back to Han, but is fatally injured in the crash landing.

Now that's one heckuva crash, that the ship survives but not the pilot...

In the original trilogy...that's a hard one to call. Is Mon Mothma "main" enough?

Jedi Minch

Main: Do you know their name?

Luke, Han, Leia, Chewie, 3po, R2, Mon Mothma, Lando, Wedge,Ackbar, Crix Madine, Dodonna are examples. Basically anyone we could recognize. Not the " Sandtrooper with the black pauldron entered the Cantina." (Sorry Minch, I KNOW thats the stormtrooper you were gonna pick, remember GMTA. Razz

)

Ship survives and the pilot don't: Think of the Falcons cockpit a mangled mess after do a belly landing in a cruisers docking bay. Skidding to a stop after destroying anything in its path.

Krash · Jedi Knight Joined: Mar 20, 2004 Posts: 3495

Coyote wrote:

Basically anyone we could recognize. Not the " Sandtrooper with the black pauldron entered the Cantina."

Yeah, but that guy was a jerk and deserved to get blasted! Wink

Jedi_Minch · Youngling Joined: Aug 11, 2006 Posts: 158

Coyote wrote:

Main: Do you know their name?

Luke, Han, Leia, Chewie, 3po, R2, Mon Mothma, Lando, Wedge,Ackbar, Crix Madine, Dodonna are examples. Basically anyone we could recognize. Not the " Sandtrooper with the black pauldron entered the Cantina." (Sorry Minch, I KNOW thats the stormtrooper you were gonna pick, remember GMTA. Razz

)

Indeed, we GMs are TAing quite well. Okay, so Dexter Jettster and Mon Mothma--that glorified schoolmarm!--are both main characters. I stand by the Order 66 routine on both of them. (Hmmm, having been Emperor, I do believe I could make that stick...almost. Wink

)

Coyote wrote:

Ship survives and the pilot don't: Think of the Falcons cockpit a mangled mess after do a belly landing in a cruisers docking bay. Skidding to a stop after destroying anything in its path.

I dunno...that still sounds pretty out there. I mean, a bad belly-landing and hangar bay demo-derby is bound to foul up the Falcon severely, and, if memory serves, Lando was in the left-hand seat, the seat closest to the main fuselage, and, seemingly, best situated to survive an impact--I just don't see how you could have such selective casualties, and that poor little Sullustan--Nien Nunb?--would have likely been taken out, too.

How's this for an alternate scenario:

The Falcon's drive starts malfunctioning on approach, Lando and whatsisname the Sullustan heroically bring her in and make a successful landing, but then, without warning, the negative power coupling blows, overloading the alluvial dampers, causing a flux capacitor to shoot out of a junction box, pegging Lando in the back of the head as he debarks, killing him instantly. Damage to the Falcon is nonstructural, and easily repaired, of course (and who would notice a few more holes and some patches on the hull?), but not even with all the bacta in the galaxy could Two-One-B put Lando's shattered brain back together again.

Jedi Minch

Jedi_Minch · Youngling Joined: Aug 11, 2006 Posts: 158

Krash wrote:

Prequels: I think I would have given Mace Windu a more "honorable" death then getting sucker-punch slashed by Anakin then dropped out the window by Palpatine. The whole "stabbed in the back" thing with Anakin could have been done more dramatically and I think of all the jedi Mace should have gone down fighting to the last breath.

Mace should have been cut down in the Chancellor's office, with the other Jedi. Against the Emperor, he stood no chance. He survived as long as he did only because Palpatine required him for the purposes of completeing Anakin's journey to the dark side. Mace's powers were inferior to Yoda's--Yoda could turn the Force lightning with his bare hands; Windu needed the lightsaber, just as Obi-Wan did--and he was faced with the mightiest of all the Sith *and* The Chosen One, who was even more heavily midichlorianated than Yoda. Whether Anakin amputated his hand or not, once he turned his saber from guarding against Palpatine's Force bolts, whether sliced away by Anakin, or turned away by Windu himself to counter Anakin, Palptine's greater power would have carried the day, pretty much the same way: Mace trying to fly.

Krash wrote:

Classic: Believe it or not, I would have killed off one of the capital ships with General Madine onboard. In such a massive naval battle, I find it hard to imagine that any of the Rebellion's leaders wouldn't die in the battle; since the committed their entire fleet to the battle. In the book "Star Wars: The Action Figure Archives" there's a picture from a deleted scene in ROTJ of Madine commanding one of the cruisers from a seat just like the one Ackbar is seen in. I think it'd been cool as heck to watch Madine (a former Imperial) drive his crippled crusier right into the bridge of the Executor.

Now, I like that idea. Maybe get Mon Mothballs and Admiral Squiddly Diddly on the same ship with him, and it's a a win-win-win...

Yes: I never have been too impressed with the Rebel leadership in ROTJ. Wink

Jedi Minch

Padme92 · Treasury Councillor Joined: Mar 27, 2004 Posts: 2123

This is a really hard one to pick from. I mean in the Prequels almost everyone "main" does already die!

But if I had to pick I would say Sabe from TPM. During the battle to take back Naboo and the Palace she could die while Padme lives to save the day.

For the OT, its a toss up for me between either Chewie or Leia. Either one I would say during the Endor takeover. Like the space battle, for no one to be really killed during a battle like that is hard to believe almost. (sure if you count the little Ewok as showing how bad it was then I guess I was wrong). But I'm thinking more Chewie because it has that reality of war to it, it hurts Han (I would have loved to see Han in the movies like he was in Vector Prime after Chewie did die), and Leia had to survive for not Han to me but Luke. (after all they both just learned they were siblings! it would be just wrong to axed one then! They just lost their father!.....)

So those would be my picks....

Krash · Jedi Knight Joined: Mar 20, 2004 Posts: 3495

DonC wrote:

scene where Obi-Wan had to kill Commander Cody would have been good. It would emphasize the emotional toll Order 66 took on the Jedi.

That I like! Some of the Clone Wars EU went into the moral dilemma many jedi felt about the use of a clone army. Over time, many of these "Jedi Generals" would have developed a sense of commradary with their clones; which would make the betrayal of Order 66 that much more painful.

Minch - With all due respect, I think you're overestimating Palpatine's abilities. Palpatine can't be both the political tactician AND Jet-Li all at the same time. Folks like to make Palpatine out to be this all-knowing dude, but I have a thermal exhaust port and "let's build in the middle of Ewok-opolis" that says otherwise.

It's really not fair to compare Mace with Yoda...there's a 900 year learning curve to take into consideration.

Jedi_Minch wrote:

Now, I like that idea. Maybe get Mon Mothballs and Admiral Squiddly Diddly on the same ship with him, and it's a a win-win-win...

Wishful thinking aside, you need some of the Alliance leadership to survive for when they rebuild the galaxy after Palpatine's 20+ years of screwing things up.

Jedi_Minch · Youngling Joined: Aug 11, 2006 Posts: 158

Krash wrote:

Minch - With all due respect, I think you're overestimating Palpatine's abilities. Palpatine can't be both the political tactician AND Jet-Li all at the same time.

Why can't he? For one thing, the samurai used to combine just such abilities. Tokugawa Ieyasu did, more or less, and founded the Edo bakufu, or Tokugawa Shogunate, if you prefer, which endured for 265 years.

And as to Palpatine's abilities: He fought Yoda to a standstill. Yoda. Than which no Jedi had more midichlorians, until the arrival of Anakin Skywalker. Not all powerful, just all in all more than powerful enough to get the job done.

Krash wrote:

Folks like to make Palpatine out to be this all-knowing dude, but I have a thermal exhaust port and "let's build in the middle of Ewok-opolis" that says otherwise.

"The ability to destroy a planet is insignificant next to the power of the Force"--hardware didn't matter that much, and Palpatine delegated the construction to Tarkin.

As for the port and the walking bathmats, well, how big a threat were they, really? The Skywalker slipperiness was the only thing that made the port no other pilot but Luke could hit an exploitable vulnerability; and the Ewoks could have been nuked from orbit, had there really been a serious threat from them. Bu the main purpose of the battle of Endor was to lure Luke Skywalker to meet his destiny, which it did quite effectively. As the Emperor had foreseen. He saw nearly everything; what he did not always do was *understand* what he had seen.

Compare that to the Jedi, who worked closely with Palpatine for more than ten years without really grasping the fact that he was...A SITH!

Krash wrote:

It's really not fair to compare Mace with Yoda...there's a 900 year learning curve to take into consideration.

1. Life isn't fair.

2. Are we sure Yoda was that much older than Mace?

3. Midichlorians seem to be the indicator of Force ability. I'm not wild about it, but there it is. And, if you pay attention to Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan in TPM, you'll notice that Anakin's count is compared to Yoda's as the yardstick--not even Yoda had a count as high as Anakin's, quoth the Padawan; "No Jedi has," quoth the Master. 900 years or 9000 to catch up, Windu was never going to be as powerful as Yoda.

Krash wrote:

Jedi_Minch wrote:

Now, I like that idea. Maybe get Mon Mothballs and Admiral Squiddly Diddly on the same ship with him, and it's a a win-win-win...

Wishful thinking aside, you need some of the Alliance leadership to survive for when they rebuild the galaxy after Palpatine's 20+ years of screwing things up.

Hmmm. Mothballs, Squiddly Diddly and Madine surely weren't the entire Rebel leadership? There was the Princess, afterall, who survived.

And, had the entire command structure bit the dirt at Endor, it would have simply saved (some of) the bloodbath to come when the Rebels fell to faction and fighting among themselves. The galaxy was a sorry place when Palpatine became chancellor; it was only in opposition to his tyranny that the squabbling factions of the Republic found unity; no doubt it became a sorry place again after the glue that was Palpatine ceased to hold.

My own view of the matter is that after Endor, the likely outcome was that the princess, partly trained by the hapless Luke, would have put down the feuds, suppress factionalism, and asserted ever greater control over the successor regime to Palpatine's, ultimately coming to dominate the galaxy herself through her personality and the powers her brother would have helped her unleash. In the interest of peace and order, of course.

Jedi Minch

jasconsolojediknight · Youngling Joined: Jan 30, 2006 Posts: 922

I kina like the idea of Luke going to fight Palatine losing, which then would have Leia turn to the dark side and as her first act would have been to kill Mara Jade. Then move on to her Father and then the Palatine to try and take away the Empire from him. Nuke the Ewoks from obit would have been sad to watch. One of my favorite scene is one of the Ewoks holding a Blaster. The drums also make me laugh from time to time.

Jedi_Minch · Youngling Joined: Aug 11, 2006 Posts: 158

jasconsolojediknight wrote:

I kina like the idea of Luke going to fight Palatine losing, which then would have Leia turn to the dark side and as her first act would have been to kill Mara Jade.

But...if Luke lost...then who would train Leia, such that she would have a dark side to fall to?

And, assuming Dark Leia, why would Mara Jade be Target #1?

jasconsolojediknight wrote:

Then move on to her Father and then the Palatine to try and take away the Empire from him.

This seems perfectly in character.

jasconsolojediknight wrote:

Nuke the Ewoks from obit would have been sad to watch.

From a certain point of view. In the part of cyberspace from which I come, many of the locals spent a good deal of time planning feasts featuring Ewoks--on the menu, not the guest list. Wink

jasconsolojediknight wrote:

One of my favorite scene is one of the Ewoks holding a Blaster. The drums also make me laugh from time to time.

The Ewoks did provide comic relief, I'll give them that; and the original celebratory yub-yub song: I thought they were rather good at that.

But Endor should have been crawling with Wookiees, not muppets.

Jedi Minch

Padme92 · Treasury Councillor Joined: Mar 27, 2004 Posts: 2123

Jedi_Minch wrote:

But Endor should have been crawling with Wookiees, not muppets.

Jedi Minch

I doubt that Lucas would have been able to make that many wookiees to have the end of ROTJ be affective. I mean look its was almost thirty years after ROTJ and many of the the wookiees from ROTS had to be digitally added together. In 1983 how many tall people would he have found to make it look good. shorter people (kids or adults) in far less expensive costumes (because they are way smaller aka less fabric) so it worked.